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BMZ
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Post subject: And there are folks who are educating Americans Reply with quote  

A must see from Keith Olbermann

Mosque at Ground Zero?


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Thu 16 Sep, 2010 6:39 pm
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AhmedBahgat
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Post subject: Reply with quote  

Very good mate, good american
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Thu 16 Sep, 2010 8:50 pm
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BMZ
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Post subject: GROUND ZERO MOSQUE Reply with quote  

This is from Rabbi Bruce Warshal, not from me. I agree with the Rabbi:

To begin, the mosque controversy does not involve a mosque.

It is planned as a 13-story community center encompassing a swimming pool, 500-seat performing arts center, gym, culinary school, restaurant and, yes, a prayer space for Muslims, which already exists in the current building.

A formal mosque would forbid eating or the playing of music on the premises.

I guess that we are now at the point in America where Jews can have our JCC's and Christians their YMCA's, but Muslims are not wanted.

There is also the controversy over the proposed name, Cordoba House.

The hate-mongers have described this as a reference to Muslim designs to attack western culture, hearkening back to the Muslim-Christian wars of domination in medieval Spain.

The name was chosen for precisely the opposite reason.

In the tenth century Cordoba was the center of the most liberal and sophisticated Caliphate in the Islamic world.

All religions were not merely tolerated but respected.

The caliph, Abd al-Rahman III, had a Jew as his foreign minister and a Greek bishop in his diplomatic corps.

He also had a library of 400,000 volumes at a time when the largest library in Christian Europe numbered merely 400 manuscripts.

There were also 70 other smaller libraries in Cordoba.

The very reference to Cordoba reflects the sophistication and liberality of the Muslims behind this project.

They have changed the name of the center to the address of the building, Park 51, to deflect criticism. This was unfortunate, since nothing will quiet a hate-monger.

Feisal Abdul Rauf, the Imam behind the proposed community center, has been attacked as an Islamic terrorist, even though he is a practitioner of Sufi Islam, which reaches out to all other religions as manifestations of the Divine.

My God, the conservative Bush administration utilized Rauf as part of an outreach to the Muslim world.

You can bet your life that he was thoroughly vetted by our government.

He is currently being used by the Clinton State Department as well in the same capacity.

Fareed Zakaria of Newsweek and CNN succinctly put it, "His vision of Islam is bin Laden's nightmare."

And what is Rauf's sin? He will build a Muslim community center two blocks away from Ground Zero, variously described as a "hallowed battlefield," "holy ground," and a "war memorial."

Even President Obama in his defense of religious freedom commented that, "Ground zero is, indeed, hallowed ground." I beg to differ.

If Ground Zero is holy ground, then the railroad station in Madrid, the Underground in London, the federal building in Oklahoma City, the Pentagon (where there is presently a prayer space for Muslims �?????�????�???�??�?�¢?? yes, patriotic, religious Muslim Americans work at the Pentagon) and every other physical location that has been the object of terrorism is holy ground.

If Ground Zero is holy space why plan for it to be developed with office buildings (in which the object will be to amass money �?????�????�???�??�?�¢?? obviously a holy pursuit), a shopping center (in which consumer goods will be peddled to continue to gorge the American appetite for material possessions), and with a theater for modern dance (a project to which I personally look forward as a devotee of the Joyce, the modern dance Mecca of New York)?

I'm sorry, but someone has to tell America that this designation of holy space is merely part of a mass hysteria that really scares me.

The question which must be asked is why this hysteria?

Continued....
Post Posted:
Wed 22 Sep, 2010 6:05 pm
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Post subject: GROUND ZERO MOSQUE Reply with quote  

The impetus comes from a triumvirate of right-wing Christians, Jews and politicians.

Fundamentalist Christians are still fighting the crusades, still vying to convert the world to their truths.

Islam is the fastest growing religion in the world, to the distress of these Christian proselytizers.

What better way to win this battle than to brand all Muslims as terrorists?
Right-wing Jews think that they are doing Israel a favor by painting Islam as a terrorist religion thereby proving that Israel need not negotiate with the Palestinians.

The idea is to project the concept that we are civilized and they are not. This theme is picked up in the right-wing press of Israel.

Commenting on the New York proposed "mosque," a columnist in the Jerusalem Post declares that "Islamism is a modern political tendency which arose in a spirit of fraternal harmony with the fascists of Europe in the 1930's and 40's." Ground Zero isn't Israel's "holy ground."

Why would he be involved with this discussion?

Simply because right-wing Jews in Israel as well as the United States believe that demonizing the religion of 1.3 billion people is good for Israel. God help us.

Right-wing politicians join the fray. On Fox News Newt Gingrich compares a mosque at Ground Zero to Nazis protesting at the United States Holocaust Memorial.

The Democrats are cowed by the American outpouring of hate and even Harry Reid voices disapproval of the Park 51 site.

It's a perfect storm of hate.

Periodically we go through this in America.

The anti-Catholic No-Nothing party ran ex- President Millard Fillmore in the presidential election of 1856 and garnered 27 percent of the votes.

We deported over 10,000 people during the First World War because they opposed our entry into that war and we incarcerated loyal Japanese Americans during the Second World War.

Now during this "war on terror" I shudder to think where we are headed.

The tool used in this hate campaign is the concept of collective guilt.

Based on that, all Jews are traitors since Ethel and Julius Rosenberg sold out this country.

All Christians are terrorists since Timothy McVeigh attacked the federal building in Oklahoma City.

Neither are all Muslims traitors nor terrorists.

Islam is not monolithic. Its forms are as varied as Judaism or Christianity.
I do not practice Judaism the same as a Satmar Hasidic Jew.

A Catholic does not practice Christianity the same as a Jehovah Witness. Imam Rauf does not share the same Islamic beliefs as bin Laden.

Of all people Jews should beware of collective guilt since we have suffered from it for millennia.

Yet the organization that started this hysteria is headed by a right-wing Jewish supporter of Israel by the name of Pam Geller.

She is quoted in the mainstream media (including the Jewish Journal) as if she is a legitimate political voice.

Yet on her blog, Atlas Shrugs, she has declared that "Obama is the illegitimate son of Malcolm X."

She has written that we have "an American-hater for president."

She has proposed that devout Muslims should be prohibited from military service.

She asks, "Would Patton have recruited Nazis into his army?"

To all of the rabbis quoted in the Jewish Journal urging that the "mosque" be moved, know who is pulling your strings.

Continued....
Post Posted:
Wed 22 Sep, 2010 6:06 pm
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Post subject: GROUND ZERO MOSQUE Reply with quote  

Finally, to the role of the Anti-Defamation League and its director, Abe Foxman.

The world was literally "shocked," that's the word used by the Associated Press, by ADL's call for the mosque to be moved. Fareed Zakaria called it a "bizarre decision."

Foxman, a Holocaust survivor, said, "Survivors of the Holocaust are entitled to feelings that are irrational."

Referring to loved ones of the Sept. 11 victims, he continued: "Their anguish entitles them to positions that others would categorize as irrational or bigoted."

How dare Foxman use the Holocaust to justify prejudice.

He does blasphemy to the memory of Jews and other oppressed minorities whose lives were sacrificed on the altar of bigotry.

Zakaria responds: "Does Foxman believe that bigotry is OK if people think they're victims?

Does the anguish of Palestinians, then, entitle them to be anti-Semitic?"

Five years ago the ADL honored Zakaria with the Hubert H. Humphrey First Amendment Freedoms Prize. Incensed over ADL's succumbing to bigotry, he has returned the award with the $10,000 honorarium that came with it.

It takes an honest non-Jew to bring us to our Jewish senses.

The last word was recently written by Daniel Luban, a doctoral student at the University of Chicago, in Tablet Magazine:

"While activists like Pam Geller have led the anti-mosque campaign and the broader demonization of Muslims that has accompanied it, leaders like Abe Foxman have acquiesced in it.

In doing so they risk providing an ugly and ironic illustration of the extent of Jewish assimilation in 21st century America.

We know that Jews can grow up to be senators and Supreme Court justices.

Let's not also discover
that they can grow up to incite a pogrom."
________________________________________________

Done!

So, instead of building a commercial complex, build a mosque right on Ground Zero!
Post Posted:
Wed 22 Sep, 2010 6:07 pm
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Post subject: GROUND ZERO MOSQUE Reply with quote  

Some clowns on another forum, did not like the posts, so I had to tell them:

The clowns here do not know that there are thousands of such Hallowed Ground Zeros in Iraq and Afghanistan.

In order to keep the American minds from getting paralyzed further, it is imperative that the site should be built
and converted into something else.

We cannot let a nation live on a few acres of a baggage. It is not healthy for a nation to live with an old baggage.

They need to put this episode behind and move on.

Do we see Iraqis crying, whining, ranting and grumbling everyday and do we see them remembering 319 every year?

Anyway, the place is an eye-sore in New York. they should build the Twin Towers again and there should be two mosques on the top floors, connected with an air-bridge.

If the Republican Admin Idiots had not wasted one or two years on a blow job by Monica, Clinton would have finished Osama and there would have been no 911.

Salaams
BMZ
Post Posted:
Wed 22 Sep, 2010 6:09 pm
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Post subject: MICHAEL MOORE ON GROUND ZERO MOSQUE Reply with quote  

Michael Moore wants the GZ Mosque exactly at Ground Zero.

I am with Michael Moore on this. Any objections?

Michael Moore's daily blog:

"I am opposed to the building of the "mosque" two blocks from Ground Zero.

I want it built on Ground Zero.

Why? Because I believe in an America that protects those who are the victims of hate and prejudice.

I believe in an America that says you have the right to worship whatever God you have, wherever you want to worship.

And I believe in an America that says to the world that we are a loving and generous people and if a bunch of murderers steal your religion from you and use it as their excuse to kill 3,000 souls, then I want to help you get your religion back.

And I want to put it at the spot where it was stolen from you.

There's been so much that's been said about this manufactured controversy, I really don't want to waste any time on this day of remembrance talking about it.

But I hate bigotry and I hate liars, and so in case you missed any of the truth that's been lost in this, let me point out a few facts:

1. I love the Burlington Coat Factory. I've gotten some great winter coats there at a very reasonable price. Muslims have been holding their daily prayers there since 2009.

No one ever complained about that. This is not going to be a "mosque," it's going to be a community center. It will have the same prayer room in it that's already there.

But to even have to assure people that "it's not going to be mosque" is so offensive, I now wish they would just build a 111-story mosque there.

That would be better than the lame and disgusting way the developer has left Ground Zero an empty hole until recently.

The remains of over 1,100 people still haven't been found. That site is a sacred graveyard, and to be building another monument to commerce on it is a sacrilege.

Why wasn't the entire site turned into a memorial peace park?

People died there, and many of their remains are still strewn about, all these years later.

2. Guess who has helped the Muslims organize their plans for this community center?

The JEWISH COMMUNITY CENTER of Manhattan!

Their rabbi has been advising them since the beginning. It's been a picture-perfect example of the kind of world we all want to live in.

Peter Stuyvessant, New York's "founder," tried to expel the first Jews who arrived in Manhattan.

Then the Dutch said, no, that's a bit much.

So then Stuyvessant said ok, you can stay, but you cannot build a synagogue anywhere in Manhattan.

Do your stupid Friday night thing at home.

The first Jewish temple was not allowed to be built until 1730.

Then there was a revolution, and the founding fathers said this country has to be secular -- no religious nuts or state religions.

To be continued.....
Post Posted:
Wed 22 Sep, 2010 6:17 pm
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Post subject: MICHAEL MOORE ON GROUND ZERO MOSQUE Reply with quote  

Continued:

George Washington (inaugurated around the corner from Ground Zero) wanted to make a statement about this his very first year in office, and wrote this to American Jews:

"The citizens of the United States of America have a right to applaud themselves for having given to mankind examples of an enlarged and liberal policy -- a policy worthy of imitation....

"It is now no more that toleration is spoken of as if it were the indulgence of one class of people that another enjoyed the exercise of their inherent natural rights, for, happily, the Government of the United States, which gives to bigotry no sanction, to persecution no assistance, requires only that they who live under its protection should demean themselves as good citizens ...

"May the children of the stock of Abraham who dwell in this land continue to merit and enjoy the good will of the other inhabitants -- while every one shall sit in safety under his own vine and fig tree and there shall be none to make him afraid."

3. The Imam in charge of this project is the nicest guy you'd ever want to meet.

4. Around five dozen Muslims died at the World Trade Center on 9/11.

Hundreds of members of their families still grieve and suffer.

The 19 killers did not care what religion anyone belonged to when they took those lives.

5. I've never read a sadder headline in the New York Times than the one on the front page this past Monday:

"American Muslims Ask, Will We Ever Belong?"

That should make all of us so ashamed that even a single one of our fellow citizens should ever have to worry about if they "belong" here.

6. There is a McDonald's two blocks from Ground Zero.

Trust me, McDonald's has killed far more people than the terrorists.

7. During an economic depression or a time of war, fascists are extremely skilled at whipping up fear and hate and getting the working class to blame "the other" for their troubles.

Lincoln's enemies told poor Southern whites that he was "a Catholic."

FDR's opponents said he was Jewish and called him "Jewsevelt."

One in five Americans now believe Obama is a Muslim and 41% of Republicans don't believe he was born here.

8. Blaming a whole group for the actions of just one of that group is anti-American.

Timothy McVeigh was Catholic.

Should Oklahoma City prohibit the building of a Catholic Church near the site of the former federal building that McVeigh blew up?

9. Let's face it, all religions have their whackos.

Catholics have O'Reilly, Gingrich, Hannity and Clarence Thomas (in fact all five conservatives who dominate the Supreme Court are Catholic).

Protestants have Pat Robertson and too many to list here.

The Mormons have Glenn Beck.

Jews have Crazy Eddie. But we don't judge whole religions on just the actions of their whackos. Unless they're Methodists.

10. If I should ever, God forbid, perish in a terrorist incident, and you or some nutty group uses my death as your justification to attack or discriminate against anyone in my name, I will come back and haunt you worse than Linda Blair marrying Freddy Krueger and moving into your bedroom to spawn Chucky.

John Lennon was right when he asked us to imagine a world with "nothing to kill or die for and no religion, too."

I heard Deepak Chopra this week say that "God gave humans the truth, and the devil came and he said,'Let's give it a name and call it religion.' "

But John Adams said it best when he wrote a sort of letter to the future (which he called "Posterity"): "Posterity! You will never know how much it cost the present Generation to preserve your Freedom!

I hope you will make a good use of it. If you do not, I shall repent in Heaven that I ever took half the Pains to preserve it."

I'm guessing ol' John Adams is up there repenting nonstop right now.

To be continued....
Post Posted:
Wed 22 Sep, 2010 6:18 pm
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Post subject: MICHAEL MOORE ON GROUND ZERO MOSQUE Reply with quote  

Friends, we all have a responsibility NOW to make sure that Muslim community center gets built.

Once again, 70% of the country (the same number that initially supported the Iraq War) is on the wrong side and want the "mosque" moved.

Enormous pressure has been put on the Imam to stop his project.

We have to turn this thing around.

re we going to let the bullies and thugs win another one?

Aren't you fed up by now?

When would be a good time to take our country back from the haters?

I say right now.

Let's each of us make a statement by donating to the building of this community center!

It's a nonprofit, tax-exempt organization and you can donate a dollar or ten dollars (or more) right now through a secure pay pal account by clicking here.

I will personally match the first $10,000 raised (forward your PayPal receipt to webguy@michaelmoore.com).

If each one of you reading this blog/email donated just a couple of dollars, that would give the center over $6 million, more than what Donald Trump has offered to buy the Imam out.

C'mon everyone, let's pitch in and help those who are being debased for simply wanting to do something good.

We could all make a huge statement of love on this solemn day.

I lost a co-worker on 9/11. I write this today in his memory.

"The man who speaks of the enemy / Is the enemy himself."


DONE!

Let us build a 110 storey Grand Mosque exactly at Ground Zero.

Please direct all comments to Mr. Michael Moore, not me. lol!

And we should call it the True Ground Zero Mosque.
Post Posted:
Wed 22 Sep, 2010 6:20 pm
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